KPOM
Apr 6, 02:25 PM
I am shocked that anyone finds this as a positive.
So you all want a drop from 1.86/2.13 to 1.4GHz CPUs in your 13" MBA? That is a 30% drop.
Uh, megahertz myth, anyone? Based on the 2.3Ghz Core i5 in the MacBook Pro, I'd expect the 1.4GHz Core i5 with hyperthreading to be significantly faster than the 1.86 or 2.13GHz Core 2 Duo. Plus, it can turbo boost to 2.3GHz.
Then you want another drop of approaching 50% in graphics performance? Remember these IGPs clock in much lower than the STD voltage SB used in 13" MBP.
That is a legitimate concern. That said, if you aren't a gamer, the CPU may more than make up for it. Plus, we all know Apple can't use the Core 2 Duo forever, and is taking some heat for still using it now.
capabilities!
So you all want a drop from 1.86/2.13 to 1.4GHz CPUs in your 13" MBA? That is a 30% drop.
Uh, megahertz myth, anyone? Based on the 2.3Ghz Core i5 in the MacBook Pro, I'd expect the 1.4GHz Core i5 with hyperthreading to be significantly faster than the 1.86 or 2.13GHz Core 2 Duo. Plus, it can turbo boost to 2.3GHz.
Then you want another drop of approaching 50% in graphics performance? Remember these IGPs clock in much lower than the STD voltage SB used in 13" MBP.
That is a legitimate concern. That said, if you aren't a gamer, the CPU may more than make up for it. Plus, we all know Apple can't use the Core 2 Duo forever, and is taking some heat for still using it now.
capabilities!
totoum
Apr 10, 04:17 AM
But later he gets called out from another speculating Apple is making a very significant change and distancing Final Cut from the real 'pro' users, dumbing it down, etc, and the guy who has seen it gets real quiet.. He is asked if he will update his editing studio's workflow to the new Final Cut, and he basically danced around the question, pleaded the 5th, and made it pretty clear that he is holding back some reservations about how the industry will adapt to the changes.
Yep,saw that,as well as the "faster horse" quote meaning that there will be disapointed people.
I think he refused to commit to switching to the new version because I'm betting on anything tape based being taken out,that seems like a very apple thing to do but as they mentioned later most huge production companies are not ready for that.
Also probably means no blu-ray in sight and no update to dvd studio pro.
I really do hope they switch to a halfway decent H.264 encoder though.
Yep,saw that,as well as the "faster horse" quote meaning that there will be disapointed people.
I think he refused to commit to switching to the new version because I'm betting on anything tape based being taken out,that seems like a very apple thing to do but as they mentioned later most huge production companies are not ready for that.
Also probably means no blu-ray in sight and no update to dvd studio pro.
I really do hope they switch to a halfway decent H.264 encoder though.
goobot
Apr 11, 11:27 AM
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 4_2_1 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/533.17.9 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.0.2 Mobile/8C148 Safari/6533.18.5)
I dont want to wait :(
I dont want to wait :(
hobo.hopkins
Apr 25, 01:46 PM
Oh please if someone has direct access to your phone or computer they could do or find almost anything they wanted. The fact that Apple doesn't even receive this information makes it a non-issue.
Gelfin
Mar 3, 02:59 PM
Bill, it's OK to react emotionally. We're people, not robots. :)
Speak for yourself, squishy meat-beast.
Speak for yourself, squishy meat-beast.
ChrisA
Sep 13, 10:54 AM
Arrays of cheap RAM on a PCIe card?
The RAM companies don't seem interested in making wodges of slow cheap hi-cap ram, only in bumping up the speed and upping the capacity. For the last 10 years, a stick of decent RAM has always been about �100/ $100 no matter what the capacity / flavour of the moment is.
Even slow RAM is still orders of magnitude faster than a HD, hence my point. There's various historical and technical factors as to why we have the current situation.
I've also looked at RAID implementations (I run a RAID5) but each RAID level has its own problems.
I've recently seen that single-user RAID3 might be one way forward for the desktop, but don't really know enough about it yet.
The reason for the RAM improvoments in speed and size are that RAM (not CPU) is the main bottle neck in preformance. A CPU can only execute instructions as fast as they can be pulled out of RAM. Now you go and put multiple cores inthe box and the demand on RAM doubles.
As for RAID. I think the way forward is Sun's "ZFS" file system. There was talk of that moving into Mac OSX and we know it is being ported to BSD Unix and Linux. Basically ZFS makes the RAID layer just go away
Read more here...
http://www.sun.com/2004-0914/feature/index.html
Sun has released this as Open Source. so it will get ported around to other OSes. I hear Sun's Dtrace is already in Leopard
The RAM companies don't seem interested in making wodges of slow cheap hi-cap ram, only in bumping up the speed and upping the capacity. For the last 10 years, a stick of decent RAM has always been about �100/ $100 no matter what the capacity / flavour of the moment is.
Even slow RAM is still orders of magnitude faster than a HD, hence my point. There's various historical and technical factors as to why we have the current situation.
I've also looked at RAID implementations (I run a RAID5) but each RAID level has its own problems.
I've recently seen that single-user RAID3 might be one way forward for the desktop, but don't really know enough about it yet.
The reason for the RAM improvoments in speed and size are that RAM (not CPU) is the main bottle neck in preformance. A CPU can only execute instructions as fast as they can be pulled out of RAM. Now you go and put multiple cores inthe box and the demand on RAM doubles.
As for RAID. I think the way forward is Sun's "ZFS" file system. There was talk of that moving into Mac OSX and we know it is being ported to BSD Unix and Linux. Basically ZFS makes the RAID layer just go away
Read more here...
http://www.sun.com/2004-0914/feature/index.html
Sun has released this as Open Source. so it will get ported around to other OSes. I hear Sun's Dtrace is already in Leopard
shamino
Jul 14, 04:17 PM
According to Appleinsider, the Mac Pro would have 2 4x and 1 8x PCIe slots. I see two problems with this. (1) All higher-end PC mobos out now have at least 1 16x slot, some have 2 for SLI/Crossfire.
Re-read the article.
It says there will be three available slots - 2 4x and 1 8x. These are the slots that will not be used by factory-bundled devices.
The bundled ATI X1800/X1900 video card will be in a 16x slot. It probably won't physically fit anywhere else!
(2) Why only 3 slots? PCs have 6 or so (as did the Power Mac 9500 & 9600) with a few regular PCI slots.
4 slots. 3 unused. Not 3 total.
Most PCs don't have more slots, either. Sure you can find a few counter-examples, but 6-slot systems are not common. And with the exception of the PM 9500/9600, Apple has never shipped a 6-slot system. (The Quadra 950 had 5. Everything else shipped with 4 or less.)
Why would Apple shoot itself in the foot like this? The Mac Pro is supposed to be a lot better than all other PCs. It would be nice to have 2 16x lanes for SLI and a few PCI slots for older expansion cards and cards that don't need the bandwidth of PCIe. Besides, this is supposed to be a Pro Mac, which means professional people would want to add a bunch of cards, not just 3. I'd expect a person working in something like movie production would want to have dual graphics cards, a fiber channel card to connect to an xServe RAID and maybe an M-Audio sound card for audio input. Since I don't work in movie production, I wouldn't know, but it would make sense.
You seem to think that a Pro system must have the capability of accepting every hardware device ever invented. (And how do you do this without making the case six feet tall?)
Dual video cards are only used by gamers. I doubt gamers are going to be interested in buying one of these, for the same reason they don't buy other Macs - the software comes out for other platforms first.
As for FC interfaces, they can work fine in any of the available slots. And there's no need for audio cards when you've got S/PDIF optical audio in/out.
Remember also that a studio won't be doing both video and audio editing on the same console! The people who are expert at one job are not going to be expert at the other. And if your studio is so strapped for cash that the different editors have to share a single computer, then you're in pretty sad shape!
I don't think you realize what you're asking for. A system that is capable of performing all possible tasks at once is just unrealistic. Nobody will ever equip a system like that, because no user will have those kinds of requirements.
Even in the PC world, where more slots are common, you almost never find a system that has actually filled all those slots with devices.
Re-read the article.
It says there will be three available slots - 2 4x and 1 8x. These are the slots that will not be used by factory-bundled devices.
The bundled ATI X1800/X1900 video card will be in a 16x slot. It probably won't physically fit anywhere else!
(2) Why only 3 slots? PCs have 6 or so (as did the Power Mac 9500 & 9600) with a few regular PCI slots.
4 slots. 3 unused. Not 3 total.
Most PCs don't have more slots, either. Sure you can find a few counter-examples, but 6-slot systems are not common. And with the exception of the PM 9500/9600, Apple has never shipped a 6-slot system. (The Quadra 950 had 5. Everything else shipped with 4 or less.)
Why would Apple shoot itself in the foot like this? The Mac Pro is supposed to be a lot better than all other PCs. It would be nice to have 2 16x lanes for SLI and a few PCI slots for older expansion cards and cards that don't need the bandwidth of PCIe. Besides, this is supposed to be a Pro Mac, which means professional people would want to add a bunch of cards, not just 3. I'd expect a person working in something like movie production would want to have dual graphics cards, a fiber channel card to connect to an xServe RAID and maybe an M-Audio sound card for audio input. Since I don't work in movie production, I wouldn't know, but it would make sense.
You seem to think that a Pro system must have the capability of accepting every hardware device ever invented. (And how do you do this without making the case six feet tall?)
Dual video cards are only used by gamers. I doubt gamers are going to be interested in buying one of these, for the same reason they don't buy other Macs - the software comes out for other platforms first.
As for FC interfaces, they can work fine in any of the available slots. And there's no need for audio cards when you've got S/PDIF optical audio in/out.
Remember also that a studio won't be doing both video and audio editing on the same console! The people who are expert at one job are not going to be expert at the other. And if your studio is so strapped for cash that the different editors have to share a single computer, then you're in pretty sad shape!
I don't think you realize what you're asking for. A system that is capable of performing all possible tasks at once is just unrealistic. Nobody will ever equip a system like that, because no user will have those kinds of requirements.
Even in the PC world, where more slots are common, you almost never find a system that has actually filled all those slots with devices.
aricher
Sep 13, 12:44 PM
I think we can all read at normal size. Besides, how do you know the IT dude typed that vs. the poster just typing what he said?
I did a direct copy-paste from my IT guy's email. What a knucklehead - him not you.
I did a direct copy-paste from my IT guy's email. What a knucklehead - him not you.
Kranchammer
Apr 6, 03:04 PM
Funny, and true.
By the same token, if I explicitly told my wife I wanted a Xoom, Playbook, Tab 10.1 and she came home with an iPad, I wouldn't be the saddest kid on earth, but I do know that I'd be returning it for something I want.
Of course, I also hate it when she brings me home a cheeseburger when I wanted a hamburger.
Ok ok ok... xoom, ipad, whatever...
you'd rather have a hamburger than a delicious, melty CHEESEBURGER?
Frigging hamburger fanbois... :p
By the same token, if I explicitly told my wife I wanted a Xoom, Playbook, Tab 10.1 and she came home with an iPad, I wouldn't be the saddest kid on earth, but I do know that I'd be returning it for something I want.
Of course, I also hate it when she brings me home a cheeseburger when I wanted a hamburger.
Ok ok ok... xoom, ipad, whatever...
you'd rather have a hamburger than a delicious, melty CHEESEBURGER?
Frigging hamburger fanbois... :p
Cabbit
Mar 26, 05:51 AM
Im guessing its going to be �45 from the app store (same as aperture). And they'll be no boxed version, or the boxed version will be prohibitory expensive to discourage buying the boxed version.
And i am looking forward to using it as a main OS, i love the better use of the trackpad and removal of visible scroll bars.
And i am looking forward to using it as a main OS, i love the better use of the trackpad and removal of visible scroll bars.
yoak
Apr 12, 09:28 AM
http://applecritictv.blogspot.com/20...l-cut-pro.html
This was posted by another member, relaytv in another thread.
Interesting read while we wait
This was posted by another member, relaytv in another thread.
Interesting read while we wait
wmmk
Jul 14, 03:30 PM
You would think they would come out with the fastest chip...
I mean what seperates them from a Dell or HP workstation that is top of the line? OS X (yes), but to the ones on the fence that doesn't justify paying more for less.
A 2.66 Ghz Woodcrest will probably be faster than a 2.93Ghz Conroe. A 1.83Ghz Yonah is faster than a 3.2Ghz Pentium, right?;)
I mean what seperates them from a Dell or HP workstation that is top of the line? OS X (yes), but to the ones on the fence that doesn't justify paying more for less.
A 2.66 Ghz Woodcrest will probably be faster than a 2.93Ghz Conroe. A 1.83Ghz Yonah is faster than a 3.2Ghz Pentium, right?;)
Northgrove
Apr 11, 02:35 PM
I don't think a September release is a problem. My contract ends next year anyway, and that's a contract signed for an iPhone 3Gs... (binding plan for 2 years) So it's time for me to upgrade *at earliest* at a time when this iPhone 5 will supposedly recently have been released anyway. Sounds perfect to me, and I don't feel "bored" of my 3Gs in the slightest. It's the apps that does the heavy lifting of this "experience" for me, and not the physical phone model/design. :)
As for new, cheaper, entry points for iOS... A guy at work *and* also a friend of mine both recently bought an iPhone 3G. Not 4. Not 3Gs. There's your very cheap entry point iOS phone today. And they're happy with theirs, knowing that they didn't get the latest CPU etc. But they knew this, and they were very cheap. Not a big problem IMHO. Don't forget the after market.
As for new, cheaper, entry points for iOS... A guy at work *and* also a friend of mine both recently bought an iPhone 3G. Not 4. Not 3Gs. There's your very cheap entry point iOS phone today. And they're happy with theirs, knowing that they didn't get the latest CPU etc. But they knew this, and they were very cheap. Not a big problem IMHO. Don't forget the after market.
Prom1
Aug 7, 06:52 PM
Excellent SHOW Apple EXCELLENT!
I think I just creamed my shorts.
THATS the last straw NO MORE EXCUSES for not owning a MAC FULL Out.
the piggy bank is now gonna be frugal!
I think I just creamed my shorts.
THATS the last straw NO MORE EXCUSES for not owning a MAC FULL Out.
the piggy bank is now gonna be frugal!
guzhogi
Jul 14, 03:37 PM
I have Mirror Door. How can I burn DVD (top) and CD (bottom) at once via Toast? I have tried and nothing worked, Toast only focus 1 thing at a time. Or am I wrong? :confused:
Make a copy of Toast and use one copy for one drive and the other copy for the other drive.
Make a copy of Toast and use one copy for one drive and the other copy for the other drive.
NoSmokingBandit
Nov 24, 11:23 AM
I'm installing right now. I'd like to just jump in, but i'd rather get it all out of the way to begin with.
Super Dave
Aug 5, 09:16 PM
Thanks for the links, Dave! I found them both very informative, especially the one on Quartz 2 Extreme.
Do you have any feel for when we will see a roll-out of the pro apps? I recall quite a bit of rumor-mongering just before the Intel announcement. Since then it has been rather silent. I thought the sudden drop in Quake might be a precursor to something fairly soon??
I have no inside information. I just read rumour and news sites� a lot! Although I use the pro Apps for a course I take, I'm not familiar enough with them to know their typical release schedule. For instance, iLife is once a year, whereas Adobe CS products are about every 18 months - 2 years. With Apple's Pro Apps I just don't know. Anyone?
David :cool:
Do you have any feel for when we will see a roll-out of the pro apps? I recall quite a bit of rumor-mongering just before the Intel announcement. Since then it has been rather silent. I thought the sudden drop in Quake might be a precursor to something fairly soon??
I have no inside information. I just read rumour and news sites� a lot! Although I use the pro Apps for a course I take, I'm not familiar enough with them to know their typical release schedule. For instance, iLife is once a year, whereas Adobe CS products are about every 18 months - 2 years. With Apple's Pro Apps I just don't know. Anyone?
David :cool:
Multimedia
Jul 21, 04:58 PM
One way to get eight cores is to get 4 Mac Minis (just wait for the lowest model to become dual core), stack them up, and put them on a KVM. You get 8 cores, and 4 optical drives for *cheap*. Just a thought.;)Problem with that arrangement is that you are limited to the use of two cores for any one appication and there are already several I use that can use up to almost 3 at once. It would also get very confusing which mini you are on at a given moment.
Yeah I could also get a second G5 Quad. But that would be cheating. :D
Yeah I could also get a second G5 Quad. But that would be cheating. :D
sierra oscar
Sep 19, 09:54 AM
The tone has not been warm to this point. Read the first few pages of the posts. There was a lot of Apple-blasting on pretty silly grounds. It's not like it's months and months later (a pattern we used to have with Apple all the time). It's a matter of a couple weeks -- MAX. Like I said, you and others can wait if you want. Heck, I have a MB and a MBP and am probably going to sell the MBP soon and wait for a revision myself. But the implication that many posts had, such as that the world was coming to an end, was pretty darn ridiculous.
I don't really understand... are you saying that antisocial behavioural traits be encouraged?
I don't really understand... are you saying that antisocial behavioural traits be encouraged?
orthorim
Apr 9, 01:24 AM
The trouble is .. I find the TDP numbers for Sandy Bridge very misleading. For example the previous i7 2.66Ghz dual core had a TDP of 35W and the current i7 2.2Ghz quad core has a TDP of 45W. Theoretically, it should only use 10W more when doing CPU intensive task, but according to anandtech who measured the task, the i7 Sandy Bridge Quad core was using almost 40W more when running cinebench.
http://www.anandtech.com/show/4205/the-macbook-pro-review-13-and-15-inch-2011-brings-sandy-bridge/14
It just doesn't make any sense. Going by those figures, if the i7 dual core was 35W, the i7 Sandy Bridge quad core would be around 70W.
Not sure how this relates to potential MacBook Air Sandy Bridge processors, but keep in mind.. there must be a reason why Samsung went for the ULV processor in their 13" laptop instead of the LV one.
TDP != Max power draw
The quad uses less than double the power of the older dual core when fully loaded - that makes perfect sense. It's getting more than double done when fully loaded too, so it's 4 cores -and- improvements in power usage and efficiency. That's exactly what I'd expect from the next generation product.
Under normal use he 2011 mbp gets better battery life too. Hmm.... Maybe I'll get one after all, looks very compelling. Even if Illl have to hack the opti bay.
http://www.anandtech.com/show/4205/the-macbook-pro-review-13-and-15-inch-2011-brings-sandy-bridge/14
It just doesn't make any sense. Going by those figures, if the i7 dual core was 35W, the i7 Sandy Bridge quad core would be around 70W.
Not sure how this relates to potential MacBook Air Sandy Bridge processors, but keep in mind.. there must be a reason why Samsung went for the ULV processor in their 13" laptop instead of the LV one.
TDP != Max power draw
The quad uses less than double the power of the older dual core when fully loaded - that makes perfect sense. It's getting more than double done when fully loaded too, so it's 4 cores -and- improvements in power usage and efficiency. That's exactly what I'd expect from the next generation product.
Under normal use he 2011 mbp gets better battery life too. Hmm.... Maybe I'll get one after all, looks very compelling. Even if Illl have to hack the opti bay.
MacsRgr8
Aug 5, 06:06 PM
I think the Merom will be introduced:
Thus a MacBook Pro wil probably be announced, and made available right away, or otherwise very soon.
The Conroe and Woodcrest will probably take longer.
So, the Mac Pro and Xserve Pro (uuuuggghhh!!!... must. remain. Xserve) will be announced, but shipping in about 6 weeks.
Thus a MacBook Pro wil probably be announced, and made available right away, or otherwise very soon.
The Conroe and Woodcrest will probably take longer.
So, the Mac Pro and Xserve Pro (uuuuggghhh!!!... must. remain. Xserve) will be announced, but shipping in about 6 weeks.
AppliedVisual
Oct 15, 03:47 PM
... hmmm ... i just ordered a mac pro quad 3ghz ... 8 cores would be somehow nicer ;)
.a
The 8-core Mac Pro @ 2.33GHz should be about the same price as the quad-core 2.66GHz. Theoretically, the 8-core 2.66GHz should be about the same price as what you just ordered.
Before you seriously consider canceling, just be sure that your workflow can benefit from the various CPU cores. Very few applications can take advantage of dual-core CPUs, let alone quad-core. In most situations, you need to be running various instances or multiple apps at once that can handle 2 or more threads to benefit from these newer multi-core systems. If you do any 3D animation or heavy rendering, scientific computing, visualization, massive database management/development, etc... You may be a candidate. Depending on your requirements, a quad-core 3GHz may still be the best performing system for you.
.a
The 8-core Mac Pro @ 2.33GHz should be about the same price as the quad-core 2.66GHz. Theoretically, the 8-core 2.66GHz should be about the same price as what you just ordered.
Before you seriously consider canceling, just be sure that your workflow can benefit from the various CPU cores. Very few applications can take advantage of dual-core CPUs, let alone quad-core. In most situations, you need to be running various instances or multiple apps at once that can handle 2 or more threads to benefit from these newer multi-core systems. If you do any 3D animation or heavy rendering, scientific computing, visualization, massive database management/development, etc... You may be a candidate. Depending on your requirements, a quad-core 3GHz may still be the best performing system for you.
Abstract
Sep 18, 11:40 PM
Of course they're going to refresh the laptops before the holidays. Duh. :rolleyes:
Agreed.
I can't believe this would even count as a rumour. It's more an "inevitability."
Agreed.
I can't believe this would even count as a rumour. It's more an "inevitability."
applebb
Apr 7, 11:27 PM
You people don't know the facts and are jumping to conclusions. You need to realize that this is a RUMOR site....